Episode 52: Alice Bag
Alice Bag: We got ready for our show at the Troubadour and we were waiting to go on when somebody came up and said, hey, Tom Waits is in the audience and he's right in the front row. I was just like, this is weird, you know. Nikki said, well, just, you know what, before we start playing, I want to say something to him. Of course we're all like, shit, what's he gonna say to him?
Josh Caldwell: Hello, my atypical daydreamers. Welcome to the final episode of the season. I'm gonna be taking six weeks off to catch my breath, make more episodes, create new music, and record more stories. But we will be back on January 1st, 2026. In the meantime, you can still find me over at Patreon where I'll be posting bonus stories and videos and maybe some holiday recipes.
One of the big inspirations for starting this podcast came from reading the book Our Band Could Be Your Life. It's a journey through the American indie underground from 1981 to 91, starting with bands like Black Flag, and then weaving its way through the Minutemen, Sonic Youth, Butthole Surfers, Fugazi, and so many more. What really moved me wasn't just the music, it was the spirit. These artists were working with almost nothing, no real promise of success. Just a raw, urgent need to get their sound, this new visceral form of expression, out into the world. Their courage and tenacity gave me the kick in the ass that I needed to start this podcast.
My guest today is the punk pioneer Alice Bag of the Los Angeles band The Bags. This is first wave punk of the seventies, my personal favorite. Today's episode is not a classic road story, but definitely a tale of being out of your comfort zone and not having the home turf advantage. But what really sticks with me about Alice's story is how much it reminds me of what I value the most about making art, which is the courage to be bold, fearless, to screw up, to get messy. And to do it all with your friends or those that inspire you. I think David Bowie said it best when he said, always go a little further into the water than you feel you're capable of being in. When you don't quite feel your feet touching the bottom, you're just about in the right place to do something exciting.
Alice Bag: The difference for the very early punks like me is that punk hadn't really taken hold all over the United States. It was in the big cities in the late seventies, when I was active with the Bags. It was in New York and it was in San Francisco and the big cities, but not in Toledo, Ohio or some smaller place. And sometimes those places are crucial to the way you're touring, if you're driving every five, six, seven hours. You don't want to drive more than that in a day.
When I was in my punk band in the seventies, there wasn't that kind of scene to support it. Bands like the Sex Pistols who toured outside the big cities in the United States, who decided they would go to the South, they didn't do so well. And what there is is actually a lot of prejudice, because people don't understand why these weirdos look the way they do and what are they gonna do to our club. They dance in this aggressive, crazy way. And a lot of places are still like, yeah, we're gonna have the tables up to the front of the stage and a two-drink minimum. And the punks weren't gonna have that. So we got a bad reputation. As punk got a little bit more widespread, those communities did exist and the possibility of touring became possible and better supported. There were certain places where you could stay, certain houses that were used to putting up punks, and clubs where you could sleep. Whether it's a floor or garage or whatever.
Alice Bag: I feel like every show, I was in the moment. They were all good in some way because they all contributed to us really bonding as a community. Even the shitty ones where people got in trouble and got thrown out, they still made us stronger as a community. And the show that stands out is the Troubadour show. It actually starts in a deli. A Jewish deli called Canter's in LA, where I was waiting for a seat with some friends of mine. This guy walked in and he seemed to know my friend and they started talking and she came over excitedly and said, that's Tom Waits. He's a famous singer. And I had never heard of him. And I was introduced to him through our mutual friend and I said, we're playing at the Troubadour next week, you know, please come. I was always taught to be nice so I was cordial to everyone.
And then later on my friend went over and talked to him for a little bit and came back and as we were driving home she started telling us, Alice, he thought you were hot stuff and he wants to go to your show. But he was talking about Nikki like, who's that dip she's with? Is that her boyfriend? And then Nikki got pissed off, but then we just forgot about it because Tom Waits wasn't really on our radar. So we just focused on getting ready for the show.
At the time Nikki Beat was playing drums with us because we were between drummers. So we got ready for our show at the Troubadour and we were waiting to go on when somebody came up and said, hey, Tom Waits is in the audience and he's right in the front row. He's sitting at a table, like right in front. I was just like, this is weird, you know. Nikki said, well, before we start playing, I want to say something to him. Of course we're all like, shit, what's he gonna say to him? Okay, okay, you go up first and then we'll come out and we'll play. The Troubadour is one of those places that had the tables all the way up to the front of the stage and had a two-drink minimum.
Alice Bag: It was kind of weird looking at the show because I was thinking, what are our fans gonna do? Are they just gonna stand in the back or try to sit down and be harassed to buy two drinks? Well, that was all resolved as soon as we went on stage. First of all, Nikki went up on stage, got to the mic and insulted Tom Waits and called him out and said he called me a, you know, he called me a dipshit behind my back. And then called him, I don't know what he called him, a pussy or something. Some insult. And of course Tom Waits just sat there stoically.
We did our set and the punks quickly started rearranging the furniture, like throwing the tables and chairs in a pile at the back of the club, and dancing in the front. And all this time, Tom Waits and his group of friends, these burly guys, are just sitting at this table stoically watching the band, not saying anything and refusing to move. Because they're not gonna move, right? Even though all hell's breaking loose around them. It's a chaotic set. And then we get through the set, it's all good, the audience has enjoyed themselves, the Troubadour staff doesn't know what hit them.
Tom Waits is there with his friends and we're all like, let's go. Let's get paid and get out of here. The audience has been ushered out, and as we walk out, we notice the doors are locked. We can't get our equipment out. Like, hey, what's going on? And they're like, no. Nikki and Tom Waits have to settle this. The bouncers at the Troubadour and Tom Waits' friends, who are all these big guys, make a circle around them. And I grew up in East LA so I've seen like people get jumped. So I was freaking out. And Patricia was like, they're gonna fuck up my bass drum, she was worried too.
Alice Bag: So they start fighting. Patricia and I are trying to pull open the doors to let the punks back in because we feel like they're gonna jump this guy. They're gonna beat us up because there's more of them than there are of us. There's only four of us and the punks are outside, pounding on the doors. They hear us calling, hey, come help us. They won't let us take our equipment and they've got Nikki. So you see all this, but they were holding the doors. You could see their hands coming through, like Night of the Living Dead, their faces peeking in. The punks outside trying to get in. The bouncers keeping the doors closed and we're trying to pull them open.
I actually missed seeing most of the fight because I was trying to get the punks inside. After they had tussled around for a little bit, they were separated and both people proclaimed victory. Tom Waits and Nikki both said, yeah, I taught him a lesson. And they were like, okay, it's all settled, you guys got it out of your system, you can take your equipment now.
He was very popular at the Troubadour and that was our big mistake. Thinking we're gonna call him out and this is basically his home turf. Punk rock was kind of banned from the Troubadour after that for a few months. And the Bags never played there again.
Josh Caldwell: I want to thank Alice for sharing her experience. If you want to hear more from Alice, go buy her book, Violence Girl. You can find today's story in there and much more. Also go check out all her music at her Bandcamp. Links in the show notes. Now, do you know anyone who loves punk? Or even Tom Waits? Text this episode to them. It's a good dose of fun. This podcast is created and produced by me, Josh Caldwell. Music by Visual Aid, my side music project. General support and copywriting by Miranda Caldwell. Thank you for listening, and I hope you come back next time.
